What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

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    Indy
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    What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:23 pm

    So growing up, My dream in life wasn't to be a wrestler. It was to start a promotion. As early as 8 years old I was drawing wrestlings and booking them in matches. Long story short. Most of you know about my short-lived wrestling career. If you haven't, Enjoy this awful match against a 16 year old and a dude having his 1st match.



    Anyway, Life has been interesting for me the past few years and now my childhood friend and I are in a position to actually run some shows.

    I'm not some "put Vince out of business" money mark. I just want to have a cool, different show.

    I haven't made the plunge financially yet, but I'll probably atleast buy the ring next month if nothing else.

    Anyway-- I consider you guys the coolest wrestling fanbase with broad interest in many different companies around the world.

    When you order a DVD or go to a show, What do you really look for?

    What is your idea of a perfect Indy show?

    Here's mine:

    -6, maybe 7 matches. I hate shows that insist on 10 matches. I've been to some great local ACW shows and ROH shows that were 5 hours long. The burnout factor was crazy for me.

    -Character Development. Modest but consistent attempts at establishing wrestlers with the fan base. 1 minute interviews before/after a match. Something like that.

    -Name .vs. Local: I don't understand why local companies bring in names to wrestle names. That's counterproductive. I like seeing a talented local guy dance with a name. I definitely appreciate the local guy winning.

    -1 belt (MAYBE.. JUST MAYBE A TAG BELT AS WELL). I'm a stickler for half of the card being for some dumb meaningless title. I also don't like Indy feds having a world title. Heavyweight Title or Fed Championship works just fine.


    DVD:

    -I really like a promotion that takes time and invests in lights over the ring. I'd rather have lights over the ring than a cheesy looking entrance stage with flames painted on it. Comes across way better on DVD.

    -Backstage segments that mean something. I've been to a few Indies that have a projector screen to play backstage segments, But if you can't do it live. Perhaps augment the show on DVD and create another avenue to develop characters. Especially segments putting a name/local talent in front of a camera together.




    Just a thought thread, I'm very interested to see what other people look for as I know my tastes are distant. I'll prolly add more as it comes to me.

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    Xero

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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Xero on Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:41 pm

    Japanese people.
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    Indy
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:43 pm

    Love me some japs.
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    Swarles
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Swarles on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:11 am

    Before i start posting things, DO YOU REALLY WANT TO DO THIS? Like....you're going to lose money. I'm sure you know this, but i figured I'd just remind you.

    1. 8 matches tops. 7 is probably better.

    2. I have no idea what your local indy scene is like, but if possible just don't book all the same guys as another local company.

    3. If you're going to get lights wait until you can get good lights. If you can't get good lights, just leave the house lights on.

    4. Pick a theme for your shows if you can. A lot of local companies just book whatever they can to make the best show, but having your show stick to a specific style or tone will help it stand out.

    5. I wouldn't even worry about a belt until you know your going to do more than 1 or 2 shows.

    6. DVDs are out bro!! MP4 downloads is where it is at.

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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by SBR on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:18 am

    Honestly as long as the wrestling is good it doesn't matter to me. One name could get me in the door but the undercard gets you to come back.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:22 am

    Agreed on the DVD thing. YouTube's on demand service is sufficient.


    Also-- Texas is pretty much free to run shows. Which for a long time has been more of a curse than a blessing. So it's not really as expensive as states with Commissions/Insurance demands.



    Also-- Do you guys think Indy shows MUST be on weekends? I was thinking about running on Tuesday Nights. Not a whole lot going on Tuesdays Nights in America and it opens up the field for names that are booked a year in advance on weekends.
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by SBR on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:24 am

    I mean I've been to Yankee games on Tuesday nights against the Red Sox where the stadium is only half full. People don't really like going and doing stuff on weeknights here in NY, I don't know the situation where you are though.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:32 am

    Yeah, I think it's definitely subjective to the surroundings.

    I just moved outside of Waco, Texas which is Baylor Country. It's an interesting assortment of out-of-towners and small farm country population (small farm country folk are the best wrestling crowds lol).

    It'd be an interesting sell to lure 100-200 out for a 2 hour show. In Texas, Friday, Saturday and Sunday are littered with tons of "competition" both wrestling and entertainment wise. And weekends always compete with local sports. So that's why it was a thought. Nothing in stone.
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:35 am

    Some people I love are running a promotion in Austin (some of the ACW crowd). And their show this past weekend was probably the best drawing non-NWA crowd this state has seen in a while. And I think they honor stuff that Swarley said.



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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by TeeBeeKay on Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:48 am

    Interesting that you brought this up because I bought a DGUSA show a few days ago and was going to post a list of things that annoy me about indy shows, but I haven't finished the show yet because it was really boring

    Show pacing, you seem to have the right idea, I think 6-8 matches is the right idea, and think the total amount of in ring time is right around 90-115 minutes depending on the show, as a rule of thumb indy guys are almost never as good as they think they are and an extra 5 minutes can kill almost any match

    Start your show on time, I hate being at a show that is supposed to start at 7:00, and it's 7:15 and nothing is happening, sometimes shit comes up and if it does make an announcement, but if you say 7:00, the first segment should be on it's way to the ring at 7:00

    Give enough space between guardrails and the ring, I know attendance is important, but I can't stand indy shows where the ring and the guardrails are right next to each other, it's an indy show, there are going to be dives and highspots, the wrestlers crashing badly into the rails or worse the fans never looks good and isn't safe IMO, if you feel like you have to squeeze in that extra row, it might be time to get a bigger venue

    Lighting, the lighting on the DGUSA show looked like shit, it was so fucking dark, I had to turn my computer brightness all the way up to 100% just to get a halfway decent picture

    I always like a fun match or two, I think you can treat your main angles importantly but still have some fun matches on the undercard, 3 straight hours of nothing but serious pro wrestling kind of sucks IMO, and I like to have some different stuff on shows

    I would wait on a belt until you get your footing, then people know who your "top guys" are, and they know the stakes when the belt is introduced

    I think weekend afternoon shows might be a decent idea, if you want to do family friendly smaller shows, do like a 6 match show with a small crew where one adult paid ticket gets a free child's ticket, then you can make money off merch and concessions, also kids don't know these guys aren't stars, you can do photo ops and make those kids day

    No live announcer over the PA, I hate commentary on the matches while I'm live in the building, it almost always sucks
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by CapitalTTruth on Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:11 am

    When I go live...

    1) On Time start

    2) Music before the show and during intermission if there is one. Small shows can have a really awkward atmosphere when there is nothing going on.

    3) Variety. While I usually just buy best of DVDs (yes, I buy DVDs) because I don't have the money to buy all the shows I'd want. When I am at a show I like to see a variety of things. Comedy, a good promo or two, some brawling, some good technical stuff... so on and so on. I think this helps alleviate the burn out factor a little.

    4) That said, I agree that less matches can be better. I would say 7 - 8 with one being a fun squash and another being brawl that doesn't take as much time.

    5) As a fan, I have to kind of - stress kind of - disagree with the name vs name being bad thing. It depends on a few things. First, if you are bringing in a name that is past his prime and will be relying more on presence and being a ring general, sure - I agree. In that case you bring them in and let them have a really compelling match with your local guy and make him look good regardless of winning or losing. If you are bringing in a name in his physical prime, I am 50/50 on this. If you have a local that can really go and deliver, sure, let them go. However, I have been to some local shows that brought in talent and I felt like I didn't really get to see that talent on display. This depends on a lot of things. Can that name talent do business and make the other guy look great? Can that local talent keep up? Will that name talent be motivated to work hard with a local guy? So this is a really contextual issue for me. I think for a small show the ideal is to be able to bring in three recognizable people. Two against one another and one against a top local guy. As a poor grad student, when I see that kind of card, I generally think I will at least get my $10-15 bucks worth, even if I don't know anything about the rest of the roster.

    6) Production value when possible. Particularly a curtain through which guys walk out goes a long way.

    7) Nothing too gimmicky, at least not just to be gimmicky

    Cool If you have story-lines that are running from show to show have a website or a small program that explains them quickly. I hate going to a small local show and like 2-3 of the matches may be fine, but I am clearly missing something because I haven't gone to their last 3 shows or bought them on DVD.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by JustSkiff on Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:51 pm

    I don't know if my experience with weekday shows means anything (since nobody wants to do anything in this area any day) but we were running weekly Thursday shows, and there was a noticeable increase when we switched to Friday shows.

    The one nice thing about weekday shows is the venue may be cheaper, and for the most part you can get all the talent you want (unless they have work issues).

    The idea of doing a Name vs. a Name is that that match is a draw. Yes ideally you would want to put over local talent, but a local name vs. a name won't always bring in the crowd, especially if you haven't established the local guys yet. One way to do a Name/Name match and still put over local guys, is to put the two local guys in the main event over the name match. After you've established your local guys then you can start booking them vs. Names.

    Honestly I wouldn't worry about distributing your shows until you feel there's a demand or you're breaking even (or close to it).

    As for what I want from the show. Do something different than what the other shows around you are doing. One of the reason I enjoyed FIP so much was that it was guys I already liked, but everyone was committed to working the old school Heel/Face dynamic.
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by WWF Attitude on Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:23 pm

    I get the booking Big Names vs. Local Talent. But for the 1st couple of shows, sometimes you book Eddie Guerrero vs. Super Crazy, so that people can see Christopher Daniels vs. American Dragon vs. Low Ki. One brings them in, one brings them back next month.

    But if you're going to book Big Name vs. Big Name, make sure they're willing to bump a little. The advantage of booking Local Talent vs. Big Name is you know the Local Talent will bump his ass off to make the show look good.

    You're going to have to book the same wrestlers that seen locally (for the most part), but use them to their best. Plenty of people booked the Tazmaniac vs. Sabu in the early 90's or Samoa Joe vs. CM Punk but ECW and ROH presented those matches as something so special that you had to see them live on their shows.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by CapitalTTruth on Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:38 pm

    Ohhh yeah. I want to echo the do something different thing. Even if it is taking a chance with the kinds of guys you are pushing to the top of the card or the kinds of storylines. Like everything, it is a balance, but take some chances. This is one of my big problems with ROH right now is that it seems really safe. Every promotion that I have ever gotten into has taken chances with the product. It doesn't need to be gimmicky, but it needs to feel different.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:40 pm

    Excellent input guys, Keep it coming.

    After a bunch of google searching to verify the name is unique, Me and my bro are gonna call the show "ALL GLORY PRO."

    Venues are cheaper during the week.  I found a civic center that chargers only $250 for weekdays.

    Definitely like the Name .vs. Local discussion.  I think the valid points are you need the Big Mac to draw people in and then they realize the coke and fries were good, too.



    Here's an odd question..

    Does ring size matter to you?   Most indies use 16 or 18 footers while WWE usually uses 20 footers.

    Do you notice stuff like that?  I notice stuff like that but doesn't hinder me too much usually. Unless it's a 6 sided ring, for some reason that turned me away quite a bit.
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Swarles on Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:14 pm

    Unless the ring is SUPER small (looking at you early chikara), 98% of people won't notice.

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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:16 pm

    I'm leaning toward a 16 footer. Pro Style (not 2 feet off the ground i.e CHIKARA).

    Black apron, black canvas, white turnbuckles.

    Not like that matters but it's fresh on the brain from ordering it.

    Now if I could only afford Swarley for commentary.
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Swarles on Wed Jan 08, 2014 7:22 pm

    I'm free as long as you fly me in or run a show within 3 hours of me.

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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by CapitalTTruth on Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:21 pm

    You could also consider working some angles at the end of the show to put your local guys over without having them in the match. For example, after your two names have their match and the heel could somehow get the advantage over the face via a sneak attack or handcuffs or SOMETHING, only to be fought off by a local boy or two who comes in and gets one big spot on em before he rolls out. I am just thinking out loud, but you get the idea.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by JustSkiff on Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:26 pm

    Indy wrote:I'm leaning toward a 16 footer.  Pro Style (not 2 feet off the ground i.e CHIKARA).

    Black apron, black canvas, white turnbuckles.

    Not like that matters but it's fresh on the brain from ordering it.

    Now if I could only afford Swarley for commentary.

    Honestly if you didn't want live commentary, you could just send him the footage and have him record commentary on it, but that would delay getting shows out.
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by SBR on Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:55 pm

    Dude tIr on commentary, ALL THE BUYS. Do it.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by Indy on Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:03 am

    lol Plane tickets ordered enough in advance aren't too crazy priced during weekdays.


    But I'd be putting you dudes to work lol, Production / Commentary / Podcast etc
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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by SBR on Thu Jan 09, 2014 12:05 am

    I'm pretty sure it'd be our pleasure to announce your company for free. The boyhood dreams would be realized lol.


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    Re: What do you look for in an Indy Wrestling Show?

    Post by JustSkiff on Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:00 am

    Indy wrote:lol  Plane tickets ordered enough in advance aren't too crazy priced during weekdays.


    But I'd be putting you dudes to work  lol,  Production / Commentary / Podcast  etc

    Don't worry I have plenty of experience stacking tables and hanging up black curtains.

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